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Herreshoff Forum => Specific Herreshoff Vessels => Topic started by: HerreshoffHistory on October 12, 2010, 06:33:52 PM

Title: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: HerreshoffHistory on October 12, 2010, 06:33:52 PM

I just came across a little mystery:

Mystic Seaport Museum owns Fiddler, a Buzzards Bay 15. Fiddler's provenance can only be traced back to 1903 when the Beverly Yacht Club yearbook listed her with with sail number E-11. The 1902 yearbook does not show a Fiddler, but a Nora, owned by Loring Brooks, with sail number E-11. The Herreshoff construction record has no name for #554s, but the owner is given as L. Brooks. Because all the other early Buzzards Bays 15s SEEM to have been accounted for this would suggest #554s is Nora/Fiddler. And this seems to be the conventional wisdom.

HOWEVER: The Rudder, January 1901, p. 61, shows a great photo of a BB15, no sailnumber discernable, with the caption: "Nora, designed by Herreshoff." The problem is only that #554s was contracted for at the Herreshoffs on January 28, 1901, thus cannot have been sailing at the time this photo was published.

Is Fiddler really #554s?

(http://i52.tinypic.com/1zn33n7.jpg)

Title: Re: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: Steve on October 19, 2010, 10:43:35 PM

Bill Beardsley and I have discussed FIDDLER at length, and we both remain firmly convinced that she is 554.  This is based on a preponderence of evidence, including the predilection of the BYC at that time to keep sail numbers with the boats (presumably to avoid causing owners to have to adjust the sail).

If you look in the 1901 BYC yearbook, you will see that all 11 original boats were accounted for (using letters as sail ids.  They switched to numbers in 1902).  All of the rest of the 15's built between the first 11 and 554 were Newports, except TOBY.  Toby has been accounted for.

Consequently, as regards the Rudder photograph, I can only guess that there was some type of poetic license being employed by the caption writers.

Title: Re: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: HerreshoffHistory on October 21, 2010, 09:45:50 AM

Thanks for reconsidering the Nora/Fiddler provenance!

I tend to agree with your argument but would suggest that a note be included regarding the mentioning of a Buzzards Bay 15 named Nora in the Rudder 1901 issue.

After all, how come the writer at Rudder was able to come up with a photo and the name Nora at the same time that Nora was just contracted for at HMCo. That's more than poetic license, that would be prophecy!

Title: Re: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: Adam on October 21, 2010, 04:40:53 PM

Here is the Rudder Mag Jan 1901 On-Line - pg. 61 :

http://books.google.com/books?id=CPo6AAAAMAAJ&pg=PR33&lpg=PR33&dq=Rudder+January+1901&source=bl&ots=qlpOFCtIHB&sig=KDtu2NX3g_1qzNVLI2Zp8QPJfW4&hl=en&ei=3knATJbeLMOAlAeciLj8CQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBkQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Nora%20Herreshoff&f=false (http://books.google.com/books?id=CPo6AAAAMAAJ&pg=PR33&lpg=PR33&dq=Rudder+January+1901&source=bl&ots=qlpOFCtIHB&sig=KDtu2NX3g_1qzNVLI2Zp8QPJfW4&hl=en&ei=3knATJbeLMOAlAeciLj8CQ&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1&ved=0CBkQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=Nora%20Herreshoff&f=false)

The only thing it really mentions is in context to his racing against the Herreshoff 15 footers in a Mower designed "R" named "Sora". The 15's he mentioned (not by name) are owned by "Belmont, Dana, and Iselin".

I make note because of Nora's owner Brooks is not mentioned - nor is Nora for that matter - the photo is used for reference of a 15 as far as I can tell.

Note^2 - Belmonts boat was "Sand Piper", and Iselin's "Hope". I do not show Dana owning a 15 in the registry....

My guess is that the editor grabbed a file photo of a 15 and someone added “Nora” to it as that was the 15 currently being built….Editorial license…. 

Title: Re: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: Steve on October 22, 2010, 05:58:38 PM

To continue this a little more:

To select a photo, write the article, edit the magazine, typeset it, print it, and distribute it by January, that image probably had to be taken several months prior to publication, which dates the image to sometime in 1900.  This is corroborated by the fact that sail numbers (letters actually) were not on the boats until the 1901 season.  Builder's trials of these smaller boats were usually conducted by one man, and this looks like an owner and his party.  In Buzzards Bay, boats are usually out of the water by the end of October, so it is safe to assume that this boat was new for the 1900 season, or earlier.  Consequently, it must be one of the original 11.  And, since Nora was not one of the original 11, she can't be the boat in the photo.

This all supports Adam's supposition that the image used was some type of file photo, and editorial license was used by the caption writer.

Title: Re: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: Robert (Alerion Sailor) on January 03, 2011, 09:51:45 PM

The picture in the first post also looks very close to a Marconi rig which means it could something  other than BB15
Robert

Title: Re: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: Adam on January 03, 2011, 09:59:58 PM

Hi Robert - could be but I believe you are just seeing the gaff edge on with the mast....you can clearly see the top of the mast just peeking out where the spinnaker halyard leeds...

Title: Re: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: Jon Brooks on January 03, 2011, 10:32:14 PM

Agreed Adam. 

Jon   8)

Title: Re: Buzzards Bay 15 #554s Nora / Fiddler
Post by: Robert (Alerion Sailor) on January 04, 2011, 09:26:45 PM

That what I thought I was seeing. I guess I would have to agree with Adam.